Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Jul 1, 2008 8:33:35 GMT -6
But there are all kinds of Prime Directive scenarios we could come up with.
Scenario B -- You are engaging in undercover observation of a pre-industrial culture (like in the episode "First Contact" and the movie "Insurrection"). While making your way through a village, one member of your party is inadvertently responsible for a child stepping in the way of a cart. The child is run over. Your medical officer estimates that she has at best a 5% chance of saving the child's life if she uses the accepted medical practises of this culture, but if she can beam her up to the ship, she can save her in ten seconds. The hitch is that half the village is watching you, and there is no chance of slipping away without being seen. What do you do?
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Lexi
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Post by Lexi on Jul 3, 2008 4:12:01 GMT -6
As for the "why are people so important just because they're sentient," I think you just answered the question. And when it comes to undercover surveillance of another culture, that's just wrong to begin with.
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Jul 11, 2008 7:37:43 GMT -6
Why is undercover surveillance wrong? Is it wrong to just watch them from orbit then, picking up their radio messages and so forth?
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Post by rubinco on Jul 17, 2008 21:18:05 GMT -6
I agree with Mr. Atoz. I would totallly beam up and then call it witchcraft ! jk. i would say, "I have a facility nearby that i can take him/her to. I can heal him/her there." then, once they are no longer looking, transport to the ship, and heal her.
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Jul 18, 2008 8:38:54 GMT -6
I think you misunderstood me, Rubinco. I would NOT violate the Prime Directive. In scenario B as I described it, waiting until they aren't looking isn't an option.
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Jul 30, 2008 10:13:14 GMT -6
Lexi raised a valid point, which I hadn't thought of before. Maybe it isn't a good idea to secretly observe Prime Directive planets. Does anyone else have an opinion?
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Post by earthcrusher on Jul 30, 2008 21:47:01 GMT -6
No. No opinion at this point. Stay tuned that may change.
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Niemz
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Post by Niemz on Jul 31, 2008 22:15:38 GMT -6
OK...tuned in...
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Aug 8, 2008 8:13:58 GMT -6
I personally can't think of a good reason not to observe Prime Directive cultures, but I'm open to arguments. It's possible that Lexi was just reacting to the phrasing I used, "undercover surveillance".
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Niemz
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Post by Niemz on Aug 8, 2008 13:45:03 GMT -6
Maybe if they could stop the planets destruction without the populace e knowing...
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Lexi
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Post by Lexi on Aug 10, 2008 2:00:48 GMT -6
Yes, "undercover surveillance" suggests something a little more sinister than anthropological studies from a distance (I recall that in Insurrection the plot line around Data's malfunction and exposure of the Starfleet/Son'a is that studying a culture to secretly move them off their planet in exchange for technology is downright wrong), which I suppose in principle I wouldn't have a problem with, except that you might get attached to the people you were studying, and then you'd be pretty emotionally screwed if there was a cataclysmic earthquake, or something. Plus, if I found out that there were aliens watching us and not doing anything to help, I'd probably be a bit angry, at least at first.
And in response to Niemz' idea, it could easily be done in most cases, for sure, but I suppose the ethics of it (aside from the obvious moral plus of saving people's lives) would come down to what stage the planet was in. For example, if there was severe seismic activity threatening to tear the planet apart, but the actual effects hadn't started yet, then you could discreetly do whatever was in your power to stabilise the planet. However, if earthquakes and erupting volcanoes and general sulfurous chaos were already all over the place, it'd be best (if you were going to save them) to just come up front and tell them that you're here to help. I mean, sure, it'd be violating their right to not know until it's their time, but if Earth were to go into million-fatalities-a-day seizures then I'd much rather have the Great Movie of the Universe spoiled for me by being saved by aliens than have our entire species perish horribly.
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Aug 12, 2008 9:01:13 GMT -6
All good points, Lexi. If the reason you're observing them is sinister, that's not good (like the Enterprise episode where the Vulcans had set up a sensor array in a monastery to spy on the Andorans). And there would always be a danger (like Nikolai) or become too emotionally involved in the people you're obsering. I think that was the point of Scenario B, in fact.
But yes, if you could stabilize the planet without letting them know, by all means go for it. The whole point of the Prime Directive is not to screw up their culture, not to just stand by and let anything happen to them.
Speaking of which, wasn't there an early Voyager episode where they had to violate the Prime Directive to save a planet? I don't remember the details, because I don't watch Voyager that often.
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Lexi
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Post by Lexi on Aug 15, 2008 6:07:32 GMT -6
Me neither, but it does ring a bell. I'd never actually stop what I'm doing to watch Voyager, not that it's on much.
The amusing thing would be if they ever made contact with us under Prime Directive terms; we'd probably have to explain what we did, and that's when the whole "right to be left alone" thing comes in.
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Mr. Atoz
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Post by Mr. Atoz on Aug 20, 2008 10:29:39 GMT -6
I would totallly beam up and then call it witchcraft ! jk. Now that I think about this some more, Rubinco has a good point, too. The Prime Directive is about protecting the culture. As long as you don't draw attention to yourself, I don't see that there would be any harm in letting one or two people see you beam up. After all, people think they see ghosts and UFOs all the time! As long as you don't leave any physical evidence behind, it would just be another "unsolved mystery".
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Niemz
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Post by Niemz on Aug 20, 2008 15:50:59 GMT -6
Maybe someone is using their prime directive on us?
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